Are “Pink Truthers” Just Lazy Whiners?
August 10, 2007 by Sean Kelly
Filed under Business
(FranchisePick.Com) FranchisePick.Com reader and Mary Kay Cosmetics consultant Brenda recently commented “I can’t believe some of the things that are being said on this site.”
Brenda was responding to comments left on FranchisePick.Com posts on the Mary Kay Cosmetics multi-level marketing program, which has been characterized by some as an inspirational program empowering women and by others as a ”cult of greed.” (See comments at Is Mary Kay Cosmetics a “Cult of Greed”? and Does Pink Stink or is Mary Kay O.K.?)
There seems to be a growing number of disgruntled and Internet-active ex-Mary Kay “consultants” (or KayBots, as the detractors call them) who speak out on FranchisePick.com and MK-bashing sites like Pink Truth. (In honor of the latter site, I shall refer to the detractors as the Pink Truthers, setting the stage for a KayBots vs. Pink Truthers showdown on Celebrity Death Match)
According to Brenda, the problem is not with Mary Kay, but with whiny “consultants” who don’t take responsibility for their own success. Says Brenda “… you are in business for yourself… maybe you need to read and figure out for yourself how to build your business instead of whining and complaining. ”
Nat says “It is always easy to look outside of our selves to find blame for a situation when it ends badly, but how about trying to be an adult and realsing NOBODY MAKES YOU DO ANYTHING, YOU MAKE A CHOICE.”
MKForever says: “Why don’t you all admit that you’re too lazy to become a success using the Mary Kay program, so you must call it a scam. It’s you who are the frauds, pretending to be self-motivated and ambitious when you want others to make you successful.”
ARE THE PINK TRUTHERS JUST LAZY WHINERS WHO WANT TO BLAME OTHERS FOR THEIR OWN FAILURES?
WHY DOESN’T MARY KAY RESPOND TO THEIR ALLEGATIONS?
Other posts on Mary Kay Cosmetics:
Seeing Pink? Mary Kay Rep Sez “Run Like a Track Star”,
Bookkeeper Fires Her Mary Kay Cosmetics Clients
Defenders of Mary Kay Speak Out!
The Dark Side of Mary Kay Cosmetics?
Ex-Mary Kay Consultant Shares Her Experience
Oh for pete’s sake. If any of the Pro MKers who say PT posters are just lazy people, would actually take the time to read the stories of these ladies they would learn they are NOT lazy people who didn’t work their business. Recently two new directors have come out against MK…these women have been PINK CADDI, TRIP WINNING, TOP DIRECTORS for over 10 years. Can’t call them lazy now can you???
Actually, the majority of Pink Truthers are women who take full responsibility for their choices in Mary Kay. Most are completely over it now and getting on with free, full lives. Many are still SDs, Directors, IBCs who just want a place where they can honestly state how they’re feeling. Unlike Mary Kay, we believe that speaking truthfully about your feelings, whether they’re positive or negative, makes us stronger and wiser. If we are truly following the example of Christ, then we know that looking at all sides of an issue, both positive and negative, is following His example. What did the disciples do when he exhibited “negativity” such as “Okay, guys, I’m going to be dead in a few days.”? They rejected what he said. And he slammed them for it. Reality is not something to be feared or pushed under the carpet. It’s something to be faced like women. Openly and without fear. And whether you agree what’s being said or not, that’s what is happening at Pink Truth.
No, we’re not lazy whiners. We are women who have given our best effort to Mary Kay only to find out that it is a ripoff and a product based pyramid scheme. We expose the reality of MK to prevent other women from being ripped off as well. We investigate the reality of MK income and expenses, as opposed to the half-truths the company tells you. We explain the reality of how to sell your inventory back, and that it is a rolling twelve months, not just the first twelve months period. We share our individual experiences. We take note of such things as constant packaging and color changes designed to keep the consultants buying new inventory when their existing products are rendered obsolete and unsaleable. We do all this and more. Yes, some of us are angry. People who have been ripped off are usually angry about it. This should come as no surprise. Now when you listen to most consultants defend MK, they all sound alike and use the same lines to denigrate those who got out of MK (lazy, dumb, etc). They will avoid or not have answers to the specific, pointed questions you may ask regarding the business. It’s like a broken record. On Pink Truth we have a variety of experiences shared and lots of information, not just the same two or three lines repeated over and over. Visit Pinktruth.com and see for yourself!
Recently two new directors have come out against MK…these women have been PINK CADDI, TRIP WINNING, TOP DIRECTORS for over 10 years. Can’t call them lazy now can you???
OpportunityBites misses the irony somewhat doesn’t she? So these women successfully deceived and scammed others for financial gain for ten years, but now they’re heroes because they stopped? (Couldn’t compete with younger, prettier new consultants, perhaps?) I checked out the pink truth site. It reminds me of these luncheons where women drink white wine and b*tch about their men the whole time. Except these women have Mary Kay to blame, as they apparently have no men.
Perhaps women aren’t cut out for entrepreneurism. Think about it. Men would have gotten pissed off, sued if they could, but then moved on. Women want to sit, and stew and b*tch. Move on, for chrissake. Go start your own cosmetic company. You’ve already got all the answers. It should be a piece of low-fat carrot cake for ya’ll.
Well, you are right Bigpig…once we Directors faced that we had been parroting the lines we were taught, and hiding from the fact that while we say we make executive level income, we don’t…and once we figured out we all were in the same boat, pretending to be successful…the blinders came off and we were left neck deep in pink poo. Mary Kay keeps consultants and Directors running on a hamster wheel, hoping for the day of the big pay-off. Of 14,000 Directors, which are the top 2% of the company, about 350 make more than 50K BEFORE expenses. A “Grand Prix” Director makes about 20,000 a year. Hardly executive pay. Thats the problem. All over America, next Monday night, there will be women invited to be a guest at a Meeting, who will be presented the Mk opportunity and 80% of what they will be told will be BS. That is why PinkTruth exists. We who sold the “dream” realized that’ s EXACTLY what it was.
Hey BIGPIG, you know, I totally agree with you. Instead of coming up with anything resembling a coherent argument, why not dump a load of misogynist nonsense everywhere? I bet you were a debate champion in high school.
By the way, I hear women get mad when you leave the toilet seat up. Maybe you could work that one into your rebuttal.
tmc: By “coherent” you mean be polite and brainless? By “misogynistic” you mean not letting the ladies have their fun, letting their whining go unchallenged? I’ll abandon the colorful rhetoric if you’ll address the actual points I raise. Deal? Might not be as comfy as the coffee klatch over at pinkstink.com, though.
#1 PinkStinkers like Raisin here became righteous because they weren’t making enough green. Only 350 make $50K or more! says Raisin. “That’s the problem” Not that its a cult, mind control, unethical, unchristian, etc. You say MK is all about the money, but if you were making big dough you’d still be swindling the newbies, right? Hypocrisy defies gender. Call me a Hypogynist.
#2 Got kids? I’ve raised boys & girls. Somebody calls a boy a name, he gets made, cries or fights, then gets back in the game. All forgotten. Girl gets called a name she broods about it for days, maybe weeks. Maybe years. I don’t see a lot of websites where guys are whining to the extent you StinkyPinkers do. Who keeps going to a website about a program they used to belong to?
I’m not saying women are inferior, but that some natural traits may have to change if they want to survive business ownership.
#3 Owning a business is a gamble. Nobody made you do it. If you struck it rich you’d be parading your pink BMW all over town, texting Paris H. on your iPhone, taking all the credit for your success. When you fail, it’s someone else’s fault.
As we say over at http://www.pigasys.com, if you can’t fly with the big hogs, stay in the sty.
PS Toilet seats go up?
“…some natural traits may have to change if they want to survive business ownership.”
With regards to traits/abilities needed in Mary Kay, BigPig; women who get the ol’ Mary Kay recruiting pitch aren’t told, “Hey, you probably need to have some business skills and be a natural salesman or you’re not going to get too far in this business.” If this were the case, you’d have WAY less women signing up.
Potential recruits are being told, “All you need to succeed in Mary Kay is to be excited and have fun!” “I just know you’d be great for this business!” and “You don’t need to be a salesman; just a teacher of skin care!” Puh-leeze. This drivel isn’t coming from some middle-grade worker bee, mind you; this advice is coming straight from the top of the pyramid.
And while yes, people are indeed capable of making choices, Mary Kay Consultants offering the glorious Mary Kay Opportunity to women are not providing the accurate and truthful information one would require to make an educated choice. Instead, consultants are spouting touchy-feely, logic-free garbage like, “Go home and sleep on it tonight, and if you have pink dreams, then you need Mary Kay in your life!”
Mary Kay is a sickeningly manipulative entity whose rampant deception will ultimately be its undoing. Count on it.
Scrib said: “Mary Kay is a sickeningly manipulative entity whose rampant deception will ultimately be its undoing. Count on it.”
Sorry, Scrib, but it won’t be its undoing. You chicks are slow learners. Businesspeople have been getting rich scamming suckers and getting away with it for centuries. You think cuz you’re outraged justice will come? Sure! I bet those Amway founders will be arrested off their yachts too! Those arms dealers will get theirs some day I bet!
You gals got a business lesson, cheaper than business school. Now you know: There’s two kinds of people in business: the SOBs and the poor b*stards. The good news is now you can decide which you wanna be.
“the masked commenter” sure got quiet after her pig, er, big debut.
Bigpig – although our opinions differ, I do send much respect your way. Thanks for responding, luv.
The way I’m viewing it, I’m defining “deception” as a mishmash of all of the half-truths, little white lies, and lies of omission that are dished out at the recruting level – this is the facet of MK that I choose to tackle. This deception is the cement that holds the pyramid together, because if one cannot continually assimilate fresh recruits into the system, it will grind to a halt.
The key is to warn women, at the pre-recruiting level of the game, of the buggery that is being said and touted by this organization. Were Mary Kay completely truthful at the recruiting level, there would be no issue – since they are not, they expose their own underbelly. Although it may appear to be so, I believe that no one ever completely gets away with ill acts. One reaps what one sows.
You are correct, BigPig – “outrage” alone does nothing – one might as well go spit on the gas pumps down at the local ArmanaLeg Express and hope that the price will drop below two bucks a gallon.
When that “outrage” is used as a motivator and a fueler of actions, however, it has the uncanny ability to make the seemingly-impossible possible.
Considering I am in the legal field, I have to tell all of you people who are calling Mary Kay a pyramid scheme to wise up and do the research! You can always check out the legitimacy of a company by going to dsa.org. If you all haven’t heard already…pyramid schemes are HIGHLY illegal and marketing plans such as Mary Kay, Pampered Chef, etc. etc. (members of the direct sales association) are not illegal. It is just even silly when I read that people call it a pyramid scam. It just shows how ignorant people really are when it comes to legitimate companies versus scams. I am a consultant and I didn’t buy anything but a $100 starter kit. Of course, I know how to do a business successfully since I did one while living in Japan. It is a work hard job but if you want to be your own boss with ANYTHING you must work hard. I feel bad for the people that had a pushy upline or they couldn’t succeed themselves and that is why they complain so much. Mary Kay has been around for 45 years and is not going anywhere. If it were illegal like pyramid scams are…I wonder why it has been around for so long? Get a grip, people, and actually do the research before you start spreading horrible rumors about a company that YOU could not succeed in.
Lisa:
Thanks for your comment and your opinion.
I have a question for you.
While Mary Kay may not be an “illegal” enterprise, and “pyramid scheme” may be used in a broader context here, you must admit that there are many, many, many women who have had a bad experience as representatives of this organization.
You state: “Of course, I know how to do a business successfully… they couldn’t succeed themselves and that is why they complain so much… Get a grip, people, and actually do the research before you start spreading horrible rumors about a company that YOU could not succeed in.”
My question: After 45 years, doesn’t Mary Kay have a pretty good idea of who will succeed and who will fail as Mary Kay reps? Don’t they already have this research? If success depends on having business experience – as you have – or a relentless sales personality, or the ability to overcome rejection, etc. why does Mary Kay recruit those who don’t possess these traits?
If Mary Kay’s mission is to empower women, to build self esteem and independence, why do they seem to set up so many women to fail, to sell them on an opportunity that they will fail at? Why would a company that professes it cares for women deal so many of them another blow to their self esteem.
You speak scornfully of the women who have failed at the program, and who do not have the personality, experience or attitude it take to succeed as a Mary Kay rep. Doesn’t that, in the end, reflect upon the company that took their money and told them that they could succeed if they only believed in themselves?
It seems a bit cruel to recruit non-salespeople and then belittle them for not being salespeople. There are many personality tests available. Perhaps Mary Kay apologists such as yourself should research them and recommend them to the company. It would eliminate the widespread damage all of these complainers do to such a fine upstanding brand in the most effective way possible: by not accepting their money in the first place.
I could be wrong, though…
Hi Sean! I do not understand why you think it would be Mary Kay Cosmetics, Inc.’s responsibility to make independent consultant’s take a personality test? You do know that “independent consultant’s” are not employees of the company, right? Therefore, if a person wants to take the opportunity to sell from this company, or any other direct sales company, the company has a contract with you, as an independent consultant, to sale the products to you wholesale so you can sell them to the public retail and, in my opinion, MK has one of the best marketing plans I have ever seen in my past and present research on direct sales. In fact, I am very impressed in their marketing plan. I liked my other business, but MK offers a better opportunity and I love the products that I have been using for several years.
You mentioned, “…many, many, many women who have had a bad experience as representatives of this organization.” Do you know the many, many, many, women that this company has helped? Also, I wouldn’t legally call independent consultants “representatives” of the company because they are independent contractors, per se, and they are not an agent or salesperson for the company…in other words, not an employee. It is the consultant’s own business for all legal purposes, including taxes. The company just offers independent consultant’s the wholesale products and the marketing plan and whatever you make of it after that is entirely up to you since it is YOUR business not any other person, including the company Mary Kay Cosmetics, Inc. Although you do need to uphold your part, per the contract, just like any other company and/or services that have contracts between yourself and a company since contracts are legal binding documents…that is why everyone must read them before signing them! At any rate, do you think the founder of Wal-Mart had to take a personality test, per se, when he founded this company? No. He saw a wonderful opportunity, he believed in what he was doing and he went for it and now look at it!
No one does my business but me and that is why I get upset that people complain about the actual company with direct sales instead of complaining about the people they signed up under which, unfortunately, in any direct sales company, you do get those dishonest independent distributors that give the company a bad name. It doesn’t matter if it is Avon, Herbalife, Mary Kay, Pampered Chef, et cetera, et cetera. However, that is who these unhappy consultants could blame…the people they trusted to help them succeed and that they signed up under that may have not been honest with them from the get go. The company has nothing to do with it and, in my opinion, I would report them to the company if they said I had to buy inventory other than the starter kit. They should not be telling you something other than what the company’s contract and literature tells you. Of course, on the other hand, everyone wants to succeed in a business so you will get encouragement and some people tend to get over zealous in their encouragement but they should ALWAYS be honest! I have seen dishonest distributors in my past business and I am sure there are some dishonest independent distributors in MK as well. That is the sad part about the world we live in today. You should ALWAYS know the person who is signing you up and, if you do not really know them well, don’t just listen to them but READ the contract that you sign that is between you and the actual company and read the literature that the company offers. In the contract or agreement, it is written there in black and white how you are an independent consultant and not an employee and it also states that you DO NOT need to buy inventory unless you want to…it is a personal decision. But, in my opinion, I would wait until I get customers to order and, if you use the products in the starter kit and go over the literature and you think you like the product enough and you have orders, then purchase the products and if you feel it is necessary to keep an inventory, so be it. Why not make a profit if your friends or anyone else is already using the product…not to mention it saves me a lot of money when I use it myself! But, you don’t have to be a salesperson and you certainly shouldn’t be dishonest…you just need to use the products, believe in what you are selling, believe in yourself, be honest, and listen to the people who are trying to give you ideas to succeed or go get a book on marketing plans and direct sales (there are many) and read it so you can understand it better. It only takes a bit of common sense which some people just don’t have, it seems. Also, just like my past business, there are some people that think working at home means staying in your pajamas and waiting for the phone to ring because you put one ad out. That does not happen for anyone no matter what the company is that they are independent distributors for…it doesn’t even work that way with retail stores, putting one ad out and waiting for customers! : ) Anyone that wants there own business needs to do the research and decide, on their own, if they can do it. That is just my recommendation. There are dishonest people EVERYWHERE but it is not the company’s fault and, unfortunately, they cannot do polygraph tests on every independent person that wants to sell their products. : ) It is just upsetting that there are independent distributors that are not completely honest because it does give the person a misconception of the actual company. You have to admit, though, that some people should also take some responsibility in their failure if they are not willing to work hard to make their business a success. As I mentioned, if the founder of Wal-Mart didn’t work hard in the beginning, it probably wouldn’t be as big as it is now. But please remember, we are independent distributors…it is OUR decision to become one, not anyone else’s and it certainly isn’t the company’s fault if you don’t succeed because they do offer you a lot of business building tools to help you even if you have never sold a thing in your life and even if you don’t have a great upline that helps you out in succeeding. But, the best salesperson is the one that uses the products themselves. Don’t you agree?
All a person needs to know when wanting to have their OWN business at home is how to READ! Many of these people that are upset probably did not read the contract before signing or read the plethora of business building materials that come in your starter kit along with products. (Most companies such as MK give you products in the starter kit and tips on how to succeed.) You don’t need to know how to do any kind of sales. For instance, I was in the legal field when we moved to Japan where I had a successful home based business in another company but I couldn’t get a job in that field because it was limited on the military installation we were living on and I didn’t speak Japanese yet to get one off base. That got me depressed so I gained weight and I came across an ad that suggested weight loss products. I used them, loved them and lost the weight in record time and looked and felt great and that is why I became a distributor for that company…I loved the products! People can tell when you are not using the products that you are trying to sell. At least, I can. That is all it takes to be successful with direct sales, in my opinion, using the products…even if it is the ones that come in your starter kit. $100 investment is not bad considering everything I got in my kit. My friend signed me up with MK and I trust her very much. I told her straight forward that I will not tolerate a pushy up-line or team and it is MY business, not anyone else’s. That is what I am trying to say…no one can force ANYONE to become an independent distributor. Companies are just out there offering an opportunity for people to be able to stay at home and work by giving them products wholesale and providing a marketing plan.
As far as pyramid scams…there is a big difference! Unfortunately, I had several clients in the legal field that were taken because they didn’t do their research on a so-called “company” and it was, in fact, a pyramid scam. That is why I always urge people to visit DSA.org to make sure an “opportunity” or direct sales company is really legitimate, plus do other research as well before signing on the dotted line. But, trust me, pyramid scams and legitimate MLM aka Dual Marketing or completely different.
Well, I know I got pretty long-winded here and I apologize. I just wanted to clarify my position on this issue and, hopefully, help you understand what I mean when I get upset about people blaming the actual company. I hope it makes more sense to you. I really enjoyed hearing your point of view…there is always various opinions on any thing in life and everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Thank you for the discussion…I think it is great to hear both sides of the “story,” so to speak. : ) Have a great day!
p.s. I apologize for speaking “scornfully” as you said in my original post…I was tired of reading such negative things about an incredible company and a wonderful opportunity. : )
Good for you Lisa, to stand up for a terrific company. Mary Kay isn’t for everybody, but there is money to be made in a legitimate and fair way for anyone who is willing to work hard.
Thanks Mary G. for the support! I have only been a consultant for several weeks and I love it. I am actually getting my BS degree in Interior Design so this is just a part time thing for me right now. :) But, who knows what tomorrow will bring, right? I just like making people feel good about themselves and I have been using more of the products myself and I can definitely see an improvement in my skin as well as my confidence! I am 41 and I refuse to “grow old gracefully,” as the saying goes…I am going to fight it every step of the way with good nutrition, exercise and Mary Kay! ; ) Take care and have a great 4th of July! Lisa
Lisa: You and Mary G. make some great points. I don’t disagree with most of what you said, but have a question.
Mary G. wrote: Mary Kay isn’t for everyone…
Lisa wrote: I do not understand why you think it would be Mary Kay Cosmetics, Inc.’s responsibility to make independent consultant’s take a personality test?
I do not think it’s Mary Kay’s legal or business responsibility or legal obligation to screen its independent “consultants.” However, the fact that they don’t indicates to me that 1) All the rhetoric about empowering women and building their self-esteem is just marketing and PR spin and sales fluff, and 2) Mary Kay is not worried about the negativity their failed consultants generate, or at least figures that the revenue from their purchases offset the bad feelings.
Mary is right: Mary Kay is not for everyone. After more than 4 decades in business, Mary Kay must have a pretty clear idea of which type of person will succeed and which type of person will end up on Pink Truth, Some Call Me Duh, FranchisePick or other sites (there are many) recounting their bad experiences. Just the comments here reveal traits necessary for success: sales ability, ability to handle rejection, basic business experience, ability to accept responsibility for their success.
Why does Mary Kay accept money from those without those traits? Why tell women that any one of them can succeed at MK if they only believe when some are not cut out for it? If Mary Kay is “not for everyone” why do they sell to anyone?
Wouldn’t they be a bit more true to their mission if they told women upfront that not everyone is cut out for it. I don’t disagree that some of the Pink Truthers (and the one called Duh) are whiny slackers blaming others for their own inadequacies… But don’t you think MK should stop taking in future whining slackers?
I understand they are not obligated to do so. As far as I know, there’s no law against hypocrisy.
“I envisioned a company in which any woman could become just as successful as she wanted to be. The doors would be wide open to opportunity for women who were willing to pay the price and had the courage to dream.”
The real success of our Company is measured to me in the lives that have been touched and given hope.”
Mary Kay carries on the legacy of Mary Kay Ash – inspiring, enriching and empowering women to do great things.”
Hi Sean! I am still puzzled on why you think it is the company’s responsibility to make sure an adult is capable of succeeding in their own business? First off, you have to be 18 years old to even sign the contract to become an independent consultant. Nobody can force anyone to sign anything so I really do not understand why you think it is Mary Kay Cosmetic’s job to screen all potential people who want to have their own business at home and choose this company. I didn’t have an employee at the company forcing me to sign up and purchase the starter kit…I did it on my own free will like everyone else. (Unless, of course, the person signing up is the kind of person that cannot make decisions by themselves.) If you don’t want to be a consultant after signing the agreement, you can get a refund on any products you purchased if they are unused. In fact, all legitimate direct selling companies are suppose to buy back any products at 90% of the wholesale price you paid for them within a year and, I certainly hope you would know in a year that selling any products is not for you. I would say after 6 months a person would know if it was right for them or not…that goes for any job. There are over 200 legitimate direct sales companies that people can choose to do a home based business and I would think that by the age of 18, you would know your personality and know whether you are outgoing enough to be able to talk with people about the product you are trying to sell. I can because I absolutely love the products and I am not a salesperson whatsoever and I, too, don’t like rejection (who does??) but I don’t let it get me down and make me give up on something I enjoy doing. But I am smart enough to know what I can sell. For instance, I definitely know that I wouldn’t be able to get a job as a car salesman because I just cannot be pushy like most of them are so, obviously, I wouldn’t put in an application to become one. I like the fact that I don’t have to be pushy in selling MK products because most people will buy the products from me because of the results I have gotten and how happy I am with them plus they respect my opinion because they know that I am a very honest person. By the way, you will see many “disgruntled” distributors from ANY direct sales company but that is not going to bring down a company that is solid and in good standing, plus a company that offers such a great product like MK does. Not to mention it gives people a chance to earn an extra income if they choose to sell it. I think 50% profit for selling the products is very generous considering not all direct sales companies offer that discount to their independent distributors, not to mention the marketing plan they have is great! Of course, direct sales and owning your own business is not for everyone or everyone would be doing it! Don’t you think? I just don’t get why you still keep thinking that Mary Kay Cosmetics is responsible for your business if you choose to become a consultant? They only offer the products at wholesale to consultants as I mentioned before…we aren’t employees. Do you think a person that cannot sale things would try to get a job at an auto dealership as a salesperson? Probably not, so what is the difference with a home based business? By the age of 18, you should really know whether you can sell products or not and, in my opinion, if you aren’t using the products you will probably not succeed in any home based business with any company. I love the positive attitude that Mary Kay Ash had and I wish more people were like that nowadays. She is truly an inspiration, especially for women. I am very happy with the company and I do believe that you can make a nice income at it if you want to do so. It is just like if you were a realtor or a car salesman, it is a job but you are your own boss so you need to act like a boss and do the work if you want to succeed with any business you want to own.
At any rate, I just really don’t understand why you are so determined to say that it is the company’s fault for not knowing who could be a salesperson or not before they accept an agreement from an adult that should have read it in the first place and also do the research before signing the contract to see if they really wanted to become an independent consultant for the company. I know at 18, I knew the kind of person I was and whether or not I could actually succeed in my own business. Of course, I couldn’t, therefore, I didn’t do direct sales at that age. :) You would think an adult would have their own mind and think for themselves. And, of course, a company is going to say positive things about themselves…that is what they call advertising and standing behind their products. But, I do believe that this particular company can back up what it says in their literature but it is completely up to you whether or not you want to succeed. Most of the successful people I have met in the past in various direct selling companies did not have one “trait” that a salesperson, in your standards, should have and they succeeded because they loved the products and they did believe in themselves and went for it. Also, most direct selling companies offer training seminars where they teach you how to own your own business and how to manage it…you just need to make a commitment to your business to attend them if you do not know how to manage a business. You can type in any home based business (legitimate ones) and will find someone saying something negative about them, it is not just MK. But, Mary Kay does so much and gives back alot and that is another reason why I like this company. Have you even read the books or the many articles out there about the founder of this company and why she started this business and gave this opportunity to people to be able to own their own business? It is amazing and she has won many awards throughout the past 45 years because of her success and how she gives back to so many people through the opportunity and through charity. How many people do you know that can even measure up to the kind of person she was? Not many, in my opinion. I just think everyone should be responsible for themselves when they go into their own business whether it is a home based one or not. Remember, it is a company that gives a woman an opportunity to become as successful as she wants to be. My goal is to just have fun, help people feel good about themselves and enjoy getting the products at a great discount while I attend college and, if I am more successful with it, that would be great too! But, I made the decision to become my own boss and nobody forced me to sign anything and I just don’t think people should be so gullible to think they can become rich quick with any business. Unfortunately, there are many people who are that way and do not take the time to do the research themselves or the “personality tests” themselves. ; )
I have to say that it has been nice chatting with you about this particular issue. Of course, if you or someone you know had a bad experience with MK or anything, for that matter, I am sure no one would be able to change your feelings about it because everyone is entitled to their own opinion but, personally, I just don’t let others influence my decisions in life. That is all I have to say on this subject. I just am confused why you say it is the company’s responsibility to tell someone whether they can succeed or not. No one is going to tell me whether or not I can succeed. If I want to, I will! Take care and have a nice 4th of July! Lisa
I am still puzzled on why you think it is the company’s responsibility to make sure an adult is capable of succeeding in their own business?
As I’ve said, I don’t think it’s the company’s responsibility.
…all legitimate direct selling companies… There are legitimate direct selling companies?
I love the positive attitude that Mary Kay Ash had and I wish more people were like that nowadays. She is truly an inspiration, especially for women.
Some contend that Mary Kay Ash was a master saleswoman who “inspired” women with the goal of recruiting an army of “consultants” and moving lots of product. Period.
I don’t know if that’s the case. I don’t know if Mary Kay Ash was a con-woman or not? But I do get the sense that Mary Kay – like most if not all direct sales organizations – is structured to “inspire” people to be insincere. It is based on a number of very inspiring lies. Here are a few obvious ones:
LIE #1: You are Consultants.
First off, stop calling yourself consultants. You’re not consultants; you’re salespeople. Every time you call yourself a consultant, you’re lying.
I’m a consultant. Clients come to me with a goal they want to achieve or a challenge they need to overcome. I assess the situation, the problem, the resources available and create a strategy and a plan. I choose from the entire array of methods and tactics possible. I have no hidden agenda, no product to sell… I get paid for my advice and consultation. I get paid to consult.
You don’t. You have a product line to sell, and a business opportunity to promote. The solution to every problem is going to be a Mary Kay product, no matter what. You get paid when someone buys that product. Consultative selling does not make you a consultant. They may be the greatest in the world, but admit it: you hawk cosmetics. You do not get paid for your advice. You’re salesmen.
LIE #2: With Mary Kay, “any woman can become just as successful as she wants to be.”
That’s BS and you know it. The success fairy will not sprinkle prosperity dust on you because you tap your ruby slippers three times and believe with all your might. Some women aren’t good at it. Some are shy. Some ARE lazy. Some DO expect things to be handed to them. Some Don’t have that special something that allows people to use friendships as sales opportunities. As Mary said, MK isn’t for everyone. Even if they wish upon a star.
However, MK would break down if you all didn’t say everyone can succeed… and if you didn’t disregard or demonize those who don’t.
LIE #3: Mary Kay cares about empowering every woman.
Mary Kay cares about empowering women who create revenue for the company. Period. They recruit every woman they possibly can with the “Believe and succeed” fairy tale. In the process, the wheat gets separated from the chaff, and the chaff blows away. The Kaybots dismiss them as whiners and losers who killed their success fairies because they didn’t believe.
So, no, it’s not Mary Kay’s responsibility to screen their “consultants.” In fact, I’m glad they don’t. It would be a lot harder to see what the company is all about if they stopped producing highly vocal detractors at the current rate.
I envisioned a company in which any woman could become just as successful as she wanted to be. The doors would be wide open to opportunity for women who were willing to pay the price and had the courage to dream.
Mary Kay Ash
I’m curious Sean. What is your history with Mary Kay Inc., if any? You seem to know a lot about the company.
I’m curious Sean. What is your history with Mary Kay Inc., if any? You seem to know a lot about the company.
Other than that short, torrid affair in El Paso in ‘74 – a time neither MK nor I am proud of – I have no history with Mary Kay.
However, I know a bit about business opportunities, how they’re constructed, positioned, marketed and sold.
I find both the psychology of the seller and the buyer rather fascinating, especially how people justify and rationalize things they do. I’m not an expert on MLMs, but I find it interesting that self-rationalization is part of its fabric, woven in seamlessly. In many ways, it seems, individuals must willingly delude themselves in little ways in order to maintain their success in the program.
Mary G: I’m curious as to why your reaction to the “3 lies” was to ask about my “background” rather than address the opinions. Is this where we go ad hominem… focus not on discrediting the argument but focus on the arguer and his/her motives? Is it hard to admit:
1) You are a salesperson, not a consultant.
2) Not every woman has the ability to be successful with Mary Kay
3) Mary Kay Inc.’s primary purpose is to acheive the highest sales and profits possible using cultlike and pseudo-spiritual techniques.
4) Greed is not the path to empowerment
Sean: I will address the three questions you mentioned since Mary G. didn’t because I find you rather silly carrying on like this and some of the stuff you say is so ridiculous to say to a small business owner like myself regardless of the product we are selling. I wasn’t going to respond to any more of your posts and, in fact, I don’t even know why I am wasting my precious time on responding to someone as negative as you this time. However, the only reason I am is because I find some of the things you say is downright despicable and, I hate to say it, but it sounds like you are a very negative person and very unhappy by the horrible things you write on this blog about people who want to succeed in life. Anyway, if you wanted a response, here it is:
1) You wrote: “You are a salesperson, not a consultant…consultative selling does not make you a consultant.”
Did you even read what you wrote? Do you own a dictionary or thesaurus? CONSULTANT (look it up in the dictionary…it also means a “professional” and if you are trained to give skin care classes and you do it as a business, then you are considered a professional for all related purposes. A professional is skilled or trained in a specific field and can also earn money because of it.) But, you can call a consultant/distributor anything you want if it makes you happy. By the way, what is so bad about being a salesperson if you succeed at it? What is your point there?
As you also duly noted in your response to my post, “Clients come to me with a goal they want to achieve or a challenge they need to overcome. I assess the situation, the problem, and the resources available and create a strategy and a plan…” You just described what I do as a Mary Kay Independent Beauty Consultant with every client that comes to me…I assess the skin care problem they tell me they are having, I help them find the right product to use for their skin type, and I give them a “plan of action” in order to use the products successfully and get the best results for them. Wow, that sounds EXACTLY the same thing you do, but just a different service is provided and we provide the products that go with the service we provide such as facials. I am sure many beauty salons do the same thing considering they offer a hair cutting service, pedicures, manicures, et cetera, et cetera and they usually have products in the salons they recommend and sell to the clients. I guess you don’t like that type of business either, right? I will continue calling myself an Independent Beauty Consultant because that is exactly what I am. I love my business…I get rewarded through the commissions from the product sales as well as making a woman feel good about her outer beauty which, in turn, makes their inner beauty shine, in my opinion. (I am a woman, I do know that is a fact…you can also ask my husband!) Not everyone knows how to take care of their skin so I am glad I can help!
Also, for your information, I give facials and help with skin care…I would never chase women around to find a client, nor would I need to chase women around to have them become an independent consultant for MK. THEY COME TO US for the products and skincare help because the products are that good and they practically sell themselves and they have for the past 45 years. So, what is your point? All I can say is that I apologize for the pushy people that are in these types of businesses that, perhaps, you came across. At least, that is what it sounds like. You do really sound so bitter about someone trying to make a living as a small business owner and utilizing a wonderful company such as Mary Kay. You know, I just ran into another direct selling company and they sell wonderful children’s books and they have a similar marketing plan but less commission (only 25%). Would you be that bitter towards them making a living and call them a cult or is it just someone who is in the MK business that you are so hateful towards?
2) Not every woman has the ability to be successful with Mary Kay. As you quoted, “…any woman can become just as successful as she wants to be.” The key words here are “as she wants to be,” therefore, she can sit at home and do nothing and she won’t succeed in ANY business or she can be a productive and successful consultant, aka as salesperson, since you seem so adamant about that word, and she could have a great small business and help others achieve success, too. What is wrong with that? I certainly can’t think of anything wrong with that!
3) Mary Kay Inc.’s primary purpose is to achieve the highest sales and profits possible using cult like and pseudo-spiritual techniques. Wow, I cannot believe someone actually would pay you to consult them when you obviously are not educated enough to know the difference between a “cult” versus a legitimate home based business. You do know that ANY business’ primary purpose is to achieve the highest sales and profits possible, right? I am sure Macy’s and Wal-Mart has the same purpose. Do you have a point there? Furthermore, I have never seen any MK consultant going around lighting candles and praising a plastic Mary Kay doll while humming some cult like chant…what the heck is that coming from? It is sad that now you are making fun of someone for being religious as Mary Kay was. Why? That is very horrible to hear considering everyone is entitled to choose their own religion. I am not religious like she was, nor do I attend a church every Sunday but I still raise my children with morals and they see the hard work I put in to succeed in both my business as well as my education and I am very proud that they respect me for it. Who knows…maybe they will become a small business owner and choose a product they love to sell and be successful! I just hope they do not ever grow up insulting people like you do for wanting to earn a few dollars while staying home to raise my children and finishing my education like so many other women that are in this business do…or any other home based business. You should be ashamed of yourself for putting down people that want to succeed in life. I really am sorry that you have such a negative perspective on small business owners which, by the way, that is what independent consultants/distributors in direct sales are known as. In fact, while living in Hawaii, I had to actually get a business license to do business from my home so I am not sure how you are saying that it is a “cult” and we just sprinkle fairy dust around so everyone can be successful. That is so silly. How old are you, by the way? You are either very young or you are not educated on direct sales and multi-marketing companies as you think you are. There are many out there such as Pampered Chef, Avon, Herbalife, et cetera, et cetera, and they are very successful, too, because the products are great! At any rate, I wish you the best. Take care and try not to be so negative towards people. That is what is so wrong with the world nowadays…why add to it? Enough is enough! Lisa
I have to say that this topic is very amusing. If you would of asked me two years ago, I probably would of agreed with Sean. The fact is, when you have a greedy up line who doesn’t care about the basis of the Mary Kay opportunity & all they see is $$$, that is when you fall and feel pushed. It is exactly what happened to me. Eight months ago, I did sign up again, I met my Director, she was honest and told me the truth. I know more now then I did in the two years before. I don’t have to buy inventory, its my business and I can go at my own pase. Inventory is a personal decition and based on your family’s budget, NOT the recruiters!! If you feel pressured to work on someone elses goals, then youre not working twards your goals and just doing what they are telling you to do. GROW a brain and realize, you don’t have to do what they tell you. People, don’t be shy to tell your recruiter or Director to back off. Most Directors do give advise, based on your goals, if you tell them you are just personal use, they will leave you alone, if you tell them that you want to be a Director, then of course they will call you more often to see where you need help. It is all sugestions, its your business, you own it, take charge of it!!
Lisa S.: Sensible advice. If all were to grow a brain, I’d imagine attendance at the Think Pink salesfests would shrink dramatically.
Lisa: Thanks for your response. I’m going to give you a little time to cool your circuits down before I respond. Breathe deep. Give yourself a facial. Relax. I hate to see a Kaybot blow her motherboard on a holiday weekend.
I promise I won’t defile the memory of the deeply religious woman with 19 chandeliers until tomorrow.
Sean……good Irish name by the way…..you are too kewl! Keep it up!
Well said, Lisa’s. Good luck to you both!
Sean, I think you already missed out on that one. The idea of “growing a brain” is for people who can’t think for themselves. The point is: you can not be a business owner if you are still acting like an employee. Happy Holidays!!
OMG. This is entertaining reading! Go, Sean!
People are still talking about this? It’s SO 2007.
Sean- Lisa S. “would of” grown a brain, but she decided to devote herself to MK instead. I’m sure if she had succeeded in MK the first time she “would of” made awesome speeches at seminar as a NSD and all the kaybots “would of” ate it up. Maybe if she had passed the GED she “would of” been able to get a better job. Give her a break, man!
Seriously? You pulled me away from boobs for this?
DUH:
Where have you been? Have you abandoned your cause? Your site is dormant. I thought the Kaybots got you… or worse – that you had joined Pampered Chef or had bought a Meal Assembly Kitchen franchise!
btw, we got burgled too. Home invasion while we slept. Scarier than a Mary Kay rally at a Holiday Inn.
I was going to erect a 16 foot Kaybot monument in honor of you and your mamms.
I know, I’m a poor excuse for a blog owner, but the mini-duhs are keeping me so damn busy it’s disgusting. I hope to prepare them enough so that when they grow up they’ll be the best Amway Representatives in town. It’s a thankless job.
That’s so scary about the burglars! I’m so happy we weren’t home at the time. I would be in therapy right now if I were you. Well, I’d be going more often if I were you.