HOW DO YOU ACCOUNT FOR GETTING FIRED FROM YOUR JOB WITHOUT CAUSE? Is this fair? 1
I don’t think that an employer or manager gets up one morning and just decides: I’m going to fire this guy! There is always a reason, a cause. It can be personal, whimsical, or whatever. It can be justifiable, e.g., non-performance, frequent tardiness & absences, etc. It can be fair to the employee. It can be unfair to the employee.
A situation where an employer wants to fire an employee does not develop overnight. There are preceding events, incidents, dysfunctional interactions between employer & employee, signs of dissatisfaction on both sides, even formal exchanges of memos.
In situations such as this, the employee is more often than not at the losing end –even if he is in the right. The down-to-earth question facing the employee goes beyond “Is it fair?” The important question becomes: “Is the job worth keeping with all the day-to-day stress and unproductive manhours?” The corollary question becomes: “Do I resign? Or, do I fight it out and wait to get fired?”
Then, the gut issue becomes:
When being interviewed for the next job, what is the best way to explain getting fired or being forced to resign from my previous job? Most prospective employers do background checks on applicants. HR/Personnel managers do call the HR/Personnel Manager of previous employers. References from previous employers are required.
Excellent tips and advice can be found in Interview Chatter.
Very interesting post Ren! Thanks for the link back. I definitely agree with your second paragraph. I know that managers/leaders don’t arrive at the “firing decision” overnight. I have fired my share of employees over the years.
I was sitting in a very unproductive meeting today at work. Literally 13 salaried employees sitting in a meeting that we soon discovered was a farce. We realized something was “afoot”. It turns out someone was getting fired and they wanted us tucked away until it was over.
I only share that to say that, the person getting fired knew there were issues. I don’t know that directly, but I know that people know when they are not performing.
Cause can be relative. There are times when organizations fire people without cause. And that is unfair. But I will share my thoughts on this subject over at Interview Chatter. Thanks for linking back to my blog. Look for my post as a dove tail from your post. Maybe from a different angle, but somewhat on topic!
Thanks, Darlene
Interview Guru
http://www.interviewchatter.com
Hi Ren,
You’ve brought up some good points and some tough questions. This is a fascinating topic to me because I’ve never been fired or had to fire someone. I do agree with you that it is usually not an impulse decision and that there must be some warning signs ahead of time. Nice post on a tricky topic.
Ren- explaining leaving a company, whether it was because of an organization change or being laid off, is a challenge that I have dealt with. Interestingly, C-level executives like the experience even if it is “only” 2 years at a couple of jobs, whereas recruiters tend to nix me. My challenge to them is to look at my performance in each situation and then I also explain the rationale. If they listen, you can get over the hump and see a hiring manager where you do the same thing.
You’ve presented some good points, Ren. I realize there’s usually a reason for letting someone go. When I was let go, I would have preferred a logical reason, one that wasn’t discredited when someone who was hired by the new manager (the person who hired me retired) didn’t have the qualifications I was told I needed when they changed the job description. Anyway, I decided not to fight it.
It seems like companies can do whatever they want to do, whenever they want to do it. They can always find a reason if needed.
I have been looking for info like this. I recently was corporately restructered. I asked if I could have a good reference. They said no because of all the performance issues. I asked them to explain that, and no one could come up with a good reason. No issues had ever been brought to my attention. I think it stemmed from me looking for another job and and it was leaked back to my boss to the point he confronted me on it. So, how do I deal with the issue of not having a good reference? Would it also be wise to mention that I had a lawyer involved and we won a small judgement?
Hi Richard, interesting question you ask. What I recommend to my clients who are transitioning from terminations into the interview process, attempting to get new employment.. you must get a clearer answer from the organization. They may not be giving you a good reference, but that is really not the question you want to ask. Go back to the HR person and ask, “What will you say, when another company calls to verify my employment?” If they are going to give details about what happened in their organization, I would recommend you go back to your attorney and get clarity about the laws in your state. Most organizations who terminate employees do not give any specific information. They verify employment dates, salary, and whether they will hire you again. The specifics typically can lead to lawsuits. Please feel free to contact me if you have additional questions.
Darlene
Interview Guru
http://www.interviewchatter.com/
I was terminated without cause from a “religious” organization. Less than a week before the release I received an email from my trainer saying I was TERRIFIC!! And I had received flowers from the organization stating they were happy to have me and that I was doing a great job. I was never given a reason. I am 65 years old.
Hi Antiquelover08! I am sorry to hear about what happened to you. My first recommendation to you is to go back to the HR manager and find out how they are coding your termination. They know whether they are coding it as “fired, not rehireable”, “laid off, rehireable or not rehireable”. The organization is very clear about how they have coded this termination. You need to know. You also need to know what they will say when someone calls to verify employment. What will they say to them? You need to ask that question so that you know how to report your termination on future applications.
If you have any additional questions, please feel free to visit me at Interview Chatter. You can leave a comment or send me an email.
Darlene
Interview Guru
http://www.interviewchatter.com
Can an employer legally say (in louisiana) So and So is not rehirable to a new potential employer calling to check references?
My company was restructuring and they were reducing the management staff from 5 to 4. I was number 3 in seniority, number 1 in performance, and number 2 in salary. At the end of one day, I was called into a room and told I was being suspended pending an investigation into a supposed safety infraction that had occured a week and a half earlier. 2 days later I was canned for ‘gross misconduct’ and I was never replaced. This was after 6.5 years of great performance, 2 promotions, and no write-ups. They then repeatedly appealed my unemployment until I had to have a hearing. The hearing officer said there was no ‘just cause’ for me to be fired. So my question is, How do I adress the fact I was fired, even though it was obviously textbook downsizing? I know from conducting interviews that no one wants to hear a 5 minute rap that makes you sound like a conspiracy theorist, even if you did get the short end of the stick?